Hey guys, for review #22 here's VS Super Mario Bros., recently released by Retrozone. Hope you guys enjoy!
http://satoshimatrix.wordpress.com/2010/11/16/vs-super-mario-bros-review-nes/
Very awesome. I love your blog. Thanks for keeping us informed about all sorts of interesting new and old games, accessories, and clone systems. I appreciate how thorough you are with your articles. Another great article.
thanks for your kind words. I try to be as thorough as I can because when I read reviews, that's what I'm always looking for and more often than not don't end up finding, especially when it comes to unusual gaming. I appreciate your support and would like to continue to grow and improve. Do you know of any other forums where there may be some who are interested in my work? I'd like more people to read my work.
Oh, and check out my review thread. Suggestions always welcome. http://www.famicomworld.com/forum/index.php?topic=2117.0
It could've used more pictures.
How about a close up of the cart label? Retrozone's's is tilted/ upside down. :(
So essentially with this cartridge, you have the arcade without the actual box because in fact the playchoice 10 is a NES.
Interesting, and making me sorta want to buy the cartridge.
This review has made me want to buy the cart, even though it's ugly as hell.
Quote from: Jedi QuestMaster on November 16, 2010, 03:45:06 pm
It could've used more pictures.
How about a close up of the cart label? Retrozone's's is tilted/ upside down. :(
No problem. I'll add it shortly and I'll post again when pics are up.
Quote from: son_ov_hades on November 16, 2010, 05:25:56 pm
This review has made me want to buy the cart, even though it's ugly as hell.
Really? I think the cart looks rather awesome, especially compared to the other carts Retrozone offers.
I don't think anything RetroZone has released is really ugly, though apparently I never got a clear sleeve with my PowerPak. That might be ugly. Clear/translucent cartridges that mimic the shape and feel of a regular NES cartridge look fine. They need a way of differentiating their product from an official cartridge. This both helps make their product identifiable and noticeably different from official cartridges. Some of the repros they sell, if they looked official, could (I'm sure) be sold falsely as the real thing. Plus, the style they use for their cartridges wouldn't seem out of place as far as the aesthetics of the 80's went.
The most important thing to me is that they release 100% new cartridges. Not only do they do that, but they also make new (MMC1) donor boards and cartridge cases available. I understand someone wanting a reproduction, but I get sad whenever one more cartridge is sent to cartridge heaven. One day we'll run out of boards of Deadly Towers or Wrestlemania carts, and then it'll be no choice but to cannibalize actually good games.
At least that means those two games will actually be worth something once that happens. Maybe that's the secret conspiracy. ;D
LOL that's quite the theory.
Anyway, post has been updated with pics. Still need screenshots, if anyone can load up and an emulator and take saome screenshots for me, that would be great.I don't have the means other than pointing the camera at the TV.
Quote from: The Uninvited Gremlin on November 16, 2010, 03:52:14 pm
So essentially with this cartridge, you have the arcade without the actual box because in fact the playchoice 10 is a NES.
Interesting, and making me sorta want to buy the cartridge.
vs. super mario bros. was actually released for the Vs. arcade hardware, which is completely different from the PC10. The games are different, and some (such as balloon fight, tennis, and baseball) use both monitors (available in the dual system version of the cab) and all four sets of controls.
I did a a pretty detailed history of the hardware, it's actually pretty fascinating. check it out here: http://videogamesarerad.com/2010/09/15/nintendo-vs-arcade-hardware-red-tent-cocktail-cabinet/
Quote from: satoshi_matrix on November 16, 2010, 12:25:12 am
Hey guys, for review #22 here's VS Super Mario Bros., recently released by Retrozone. Hope you guys enjoy!
http://satoshimatrix.wordpress.com/2010/11/16/vs-super-mario-bros-review-nes/
great review. i am a master at smb, but i have never made it past world 7 in vs. smb. maybe it's the arcade controls, but it's just so hard.
(http://iheartyuna.files.wordpress.com/2010/10/vsscreen.jpg?w=450&h=338)
Quote from: i heart yuna on November 17, 2010, 06:05:36 am
vs. super mario bros. was actually released for the Vs. arcade hardware, which is completely different from the PC10. The games are different, and some (such as balloon fight, tennis, and baseball) use both monitors (available in the dual system version of the cab) and all four sets of controls.
Interesting, I always assumed the VS games were released on the PC10; nice history lesson custom CPU and PPU units... Interesting.
Nope. PC10s were basically just RGB NES's in arcade cabinets. They can't handle anymore than the NES can. The VS. Systems are extremely unique, and I would really like to own one someday. I've got the perfect spot for it and everything. :D
Quote from: The Uninvited Gremlin on November 17, 2010, 07:57:03 am
Quote from: i heart yuna on November 17, 2010, 06:05:36 am
vs. super mario bros. was actually released for the Vs. arcade hardware, which is completely different from the PC10. The games are different, and some (such as balloon fight, tennis, and baseball) use both monitors (available in the dual system version of the cab) and all four sets of controls.
Interesting, I always assumed the VS games were released on the PC10; nice history lesson custom CPU and PPU units... Interesting.
the cool thing about the CPU units is that they are RP2A03 CPU's and they are the same for all games. The RP2A03's that the Vs. PCBs use are the exact same chip as in the Nintendo Entertainment System. There is a guy on KLOV.com that buys busted up and non-working Nintendo's, desolders them from the board and sells them to Vs. collectors. You can also buy RP2A03H chips from MikeArcade.com which are a newer revision. However the RP2A03H's won't work in some versions of the Vs. PCB...
Quote from: botulismo on November 17, 2010, 01:52:59 am
One day we'll run out of boards of Deadly Towers or Wrestlemania carts, and then it'll be no choice but to cannibalize actually good games.
At least that means those two games will actually be worth something once that happens.
Isn't that kinda the case with Stack Up now? Being worth $20. :p
Anyway, I think the Mario art is good, but the instructions for the dip switches I feel shouldhave been be placed on the backside.
As for screenshots, I have some GG hacked worlds ;D:
(http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr343/JediQuestMaster/7-1.png)
(http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr343/JediQuestMaster/8-1.png)
(http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr343/JediQuestMaster/9.png)
(http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr343/JediQuestMaster/11.png)
(http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr343/JediQuestMaster/12.png)
Which brings me to my question: can you use a Game Genie with this? :P
I'm sure it works with the game genie, but the real question is if the codes for SMB also work for this.
I'm astonishingly lazy busy. Someone post a bunch of Game genie codes they want me to try and I'll give them a go.
Jedi QuestMaster those screenshots are........huh. Does anyone have normal VS SMB screenshots? ::)
Lol, S_M; so will game genie codes work? The cartridge is more of a emulation of a VS system and less of a NES cart from what I was explained.
Just like their version of SMB 2J emulates a disk system on the cart with a special chip it runs .FDS games.
From what I am reading, it makes me wonder if this SMB2j from retrousb.com can be adapted (understand: remove the ROM and insert programmed Eprom) to any FDS game... Does somebody have a scan of that SMB2j cart from inside?
I really don't see why GG codes couldn't work on the VS SMB cart or on a SMB2J pirate cart. All it does is sit between the ROM and the NES. When the NES executes code that says "give me the ROM value at address 0x1234*", the GG says, "instead of giving you the value at 0x1234*, I'm just going to give you this other value (and possibly check what the value at 0x1234 is before doing it)." Just because the game is a hacked VS system rom or a hacked FDS rom, it doesn't really make a difference.
* note: these are just arbitrary, made-up addresses, I'm too lazy right now to look up the NES memory map.
and the Vs. SMB cart wouldn't require emulation, since the Vs. hardware, much like the PC10, is just a giant RGB NES... they all use the same CPU.
Quote from: jpx72 on November 17, 2010, 11:48:35 pm
From what I am reading, it makes me wonder if this SMB2j from retrousb.com can be adapted (understand: remove the ROM and insert programmed Eprom) to any FDS game... Does somebody have a scan of that SMB2j cart from inside?
I was actually thinking that myself, its quite the curiousity. Wouldnt it be wicked to adapt the SMB2J into a FDS flash cartridge?
I tried several game genie codes meant for the NES version fo Super Mario Bros., but none seem to work with VS Super Mario Bros. No matter what code I input, the game starts at a glitched world with Mario in the top right corner stuck inside a solid line of bricks. You cannot move, there is no timer the graphics are unstable, but there is music.
Quote from: satoshi_matrix on November 18, 2010, 01:29:08 pm
I tried several game genie codes meant for the NES version fo Super Mario Bros., but none seem to work with VS Super Mario Bros. No matter what code I input, the game starts at a glitched world with Mario in the top right corner stuck inside a solid line of bricks. You cannot move, there is no timer the graphics are unstable, but there is music.
Do you know if the ROM has itself been hacked in order to play on the NES? I mean, if I loaded the regular VS rom in an emulator, would everything be in the same place? I could try my hand at making a game genie code or two for it.
It works on the Xbox's NES emulator but you need to map a key to input a coin. It doesn't work on the Powerpak and even if it did, it would still be unplayable without that add a coin function.
All I know is VS SMB from Retrozone doesn't work with any existing SMB1 NES gamegenie codes I tried. If anyone has specifc does they would like tested, let me know.
Try SXEOUEVK for infinite lives. Works with the "VS. Super Mario Bros. (VS).nes" rom in mednafen.
Aha, so it emulates hardware? i thought it was just a rom hack or something along the lines of that.
Quote from: UglyJoe on November 18, 2010, 04:25:20 pm
Try SXEOUEVK for infinite lives. Works with the "VS. Super Mario Bros. (VS).nes" rom in mednafen.
Oh my god. Are you serious. I just went through the work of making this exact code, through a lot of trial and error, and then you posted it while I was working on it. I can't believe it. :o Seriously, look at all this stuff I had open. http://gyazo.com/835099385a4bb482c77cb534b24c1bc9.png (http://gyazo.com/835099385a4bb482c77cb534b24c1bc9.png) xD
Oh well, at least I've gotten more experience in making these darn things. It's way harder to make an NES code than it is to make a SNES code, for some reason.
Quote from: botulismo on November 18, 2010, 05:01:09 pm
Seriously, look at all this stuff I had open. http://gyazo.com/835099385a4bb482c77cb534b24c1bc9.png (http://gyazo.com/835099385a4bb482c77cb534b24c1bc9.png) xD
What, no debugger window? I hope you didn't just keep replacing it with random values until it worked ;D
Update!
The last time I said The GG was creating the mario frozen in bricks glitch in VS SMB, I was using one of my Famiclones. I tried a number of codes using a toaster NES and got different result: the codes are just ignored. No code meant for the regular SMB seems to work, even the infamous IKAAAE.
I did try SXEOUEVK though. It works! The number of lives doesn't change, but it never lowers from 3. Uglyjoe, good job! Do you have any other codes you'd like me to try?
Nope, but since that code worked then that means any GG codes created using the VS SMB rom in an emulator will probably work with the retrousb cart. Are you looking for any codes in particular?
Codes that I'm looking for for VS SMB:
As mentioned in my review, the color red seems to be unusually dark in the retrozone cart. Can you give me a code that could "brighten" the reds? Mario, Mushrooms, Koopas, Keep-keeps, it doesn't matter, they're all the same maroon shade of red.
retain fire flower after being hit
jump higher
and if possible, something like IKAAE to totally screw with it.
I've also noticed the words "THIS ENDS" at various points in stages in VS SMB from Retrozone. Does this appear in the ROM? what the hell does it mean? The first example shows up in stage 3-3.
Quote from: UglyJoe on November 18, 2010, 06:49:24 pm
Nope, but since that code worked then that means any GG codes created using the VS SMB rom in an emulator will probably work with the retrousb cart. Are you looking for any codes in particular?
Haha, I had that one closed after I'd figured out the value, though for some reason I left the others open. That's why the address was written in notepad. For some reason leaving the debugger opens makes my FCEUX crash, even when I'm not using it.
Quote from: satoshi_matrix on November 18, 2010, 07:01:35 pm
and if possible, something like IKAAE to totally screw with it.
IGEEAPAE
I'll look up the other ones, too. I should be able to convert existing SMB1 codes.
Here we go, this one's pretty awesome.
VKSLPKSX
I'm proud of it. Not should it give you permanent fire flower, but all mushroom boxes spit out a weird sprite that stays still but acts as an invincibility star. You start out small until you get hit by one enemy, then you grow to normal mario. You don't get to change your sprite into fire mario, for some reason. I managed to change one RAM value to make small fire mario, but I couldn't get it to translate into a game genie code. This one is infinitely better. I hope you guys enjoy it! ;D
Try TOUEPYLL to make Mario SMB1 red (worked in FCEU, but not in mednafen). You'd need one code per color change, so I'm not going to go through each and every one.
For big jumps, try AEOLLLXU. As long as you hold down 'A', you'll keep going up! (This should be the same as SMB1's AETLTK).
IGEEAPAE - Haha, oh wow. Uglyjoe, can you explain what is happening when you put this game genie code in? ALL manner of crazy things happen, from slowdown, speed up, crazy colors, alphanumeric symbols replacing sprites and spontaneously getting a game over. I even got the blue screen of death! What fun
IGEEAPAE - this code works perfectly on VS SMB. Great code to have.
TOUEPYLL - doesn't seem to work at all
AEOLLLXU - sort of works. 50% of the time pressing the A button (even if you hold it down) only results in Mario's shortest possible jump. This code is buggy.
Awww, you didn't try my VKSLPKSX :(
Quote from: satoshi_matrix on November 19, 2010, 12:18:50 pm
IGEEAPAE - Haha, oh wow. Uglyjoe, can you explain what is happening when you put this game genie code in?
It should be modifying part of the same thing that IKAAE modifies. I'm not exactly sure what it is that it does and I don't really feel like looking up a SMB disassembly at the moment to find out.
Quote from: satoshi_matrix on November 19, 2010, 12:18:50 pm
TOUEPYLL - doesn't seem to work at all
Hmm. All that one does is change one of the palette values. The LL is the comparison value, which, now that I think about it, retrozone probably had to change since the PC10 PPU chips use different palette values. Drop the LL off of the end and see if it works. If it doesn't, then I'm gonna have to assume that retrozone moved the palette data somewhere else.
Quote from: satoshi_matrix on November 19, 2010, 12:18:50 pm
AEOLLLXU - sort of works. 50% of the time pressing the A button (even if you hold it down) only results in Mario's shortest possible jump. This code is buggy.
Yeah, I thought that one might be buggy. Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if the code I based it off of was buggy as well.
I'll see if I can fix it up. Try GOOLLLXL instead.
Quote from: botulismo on November 19, 2010, 12:49:49 pm
Awww, you didn't try my VKSLPKSX :(
Whoops, yes I have tried it and it works well. Thank you!
Uglyjoe, I tried just TOUEPY and yes, it works, but it only applies to small Mario and Super Mario. Firey Mario, mushrooms, koopas, fire or anything else that should be the same color red as Mario is not.
GOOLLXL works flawlessly! Thanks! Not to mention the fact that it's highly amusing that a big jump code sounds like "Goal! Extra Large" :P
Uglyjoe, at certain stages, text that reads "THIS ENDS" appear in random parts of stage backgrounds, presumably some broken peace of code or something. Do you have any idea of what this could be? I'm fairly certain at one point it even read "THIS ENDS YOUR TRIP". Other being quite ominous, I have no idea what this is or what is causing it. Any ideas?
Quote from: satoshi_matrix on November 19, 2010, 07:53:48 pm
Uglyjoe, I tried just TOUEPY and yes, it works, but it only applies to small Mario and Super Mario. Firey Mario, mushrooms, koopas, fire or anything else that should be the same color red as Mario is not.
I told you those wouldn't work. You need one code per palette change, as far as I can tell, and even though those all use the same red color, they're defined with different palettes. You can see the list here (http://datacrystal.romhacking.net/wiki/Super_Mario_Bros.:ROM_map#Graphical_Values). You'd need one code for mushrooms and koopas (same palette) and another one for fire Mario. So, all three code slots used up just to do those (in addition to small/super Mario).
Quote from: satoshi_matrix on November 19, 2010, 07:53:48 pm
Uglyjoe, at certain stages, text that reads "THIS ENDS" appear in random parts of stage backgrounds, presumably some broken peace of code or something. Do you have any idea of what this could be? I'm fairly certain at one point it even read "THIS ENDS YOUR TRIP". Other being quite ominous, I have no idea what this is or what is causing it. Any ideas?
Can you post a screenshot of this? I looked into the rom and found the text "THIS ENDS YOUR TRIP", but it seems to be a part of the ending text (which seems to be a rhyming poem :P). Not sure why it would pop up in random levels.
It seems there is a glitch in the game (or is it my copy?) on world 6-1, the message : THIS ENDS is displayed throughout the level?
Satoshi can you try 6-1 on the game? use the warp zones.
Have either of you guys emailed bunnyboy about the "THIS ENDS" thing?
I plan to do just that later today, but given how god-awful his feedback is through I'm not sure if I'll ever get a reply.
Perhaps it is an effort made by the hackers to prevent people from making reproductions & selling them? :o
Alright, here's three pics I took where "THIS ENDS" appears in VS SMB from Retrozone:
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5203/5202729423_fcb4042a34_b.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/30701966@N04/5202729423/)
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4133/5203322742_bb82c27722.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/30701966@N04/5203322742/)
(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4085/5203321006_30b638f5b0.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/30701966@N04/5203321006/)
Nice review. I need to get my hands on a copy. I used to throw many quarter and 200 Lire coins into this game back in the day. I think this was around 1988 or so, I was living elsewhere, and it took a little longer to see some of the bigger arcade games. But oh what fun!
What is a lire? I assume it is a European currency?
Lire was the general denomination of Italy's currency. The 200 Lire was about the same size/weight of a quarter, and most machines wouldn't register the difference. Funny, though living overseas, most arcade machines were still denominated in US currency.
Had a whole lot of Lire to ditch when I came back stateside.... so lots of arcade gaming for me at the time!
How much is [was] 200 Lire worth compared to a US quarter?
Wasn't a concern at the time. I was a kid, didn't care about conversion rates so much. You're looking at conceptually 20 cents vs. 25 cents. ;D
great review :)