Any hobby dev group or pirates "do request" commission games for Famicom ???

[Agent X]

I'm curious on this.  A comment I made in a thread in the Buy/Sell/Trade section got me to thinking about this when I mused that I was a bit upset that no one ever made an 8-BIT "Port" (unofficial or not) of the 16-BIT Super Famicom game (or hell, even a port of the Arcade version) AREA 88.  And the question is...

Are there any talented individuals who program (or can reprogram/program), if not hobbyist development groups up to including possible known "pirate/hack companies" that might somehow take requests for providing small runs of "ports" or otherwise of games many think should have been put on the Famicom/NES 8-BIT system?  I don't know jack about programming nor have any realistic idea of how long such an undertaking might be, but it's a question I figured I'd throw out there to our community.  Personally I'd pay several hundred bucks for a decent controlling and pretty nice looking (for an 8-BIT) version of AREA 88 {UN Squadron}, and I can think of several other games ---both Arcade and Console games--- I'd plunk the dough down for for the privilege of powering up and playing on my beloved AV FAMICOM system.  On the AREA 88 note, even a quick hack/port mapped to work with the Famicom of the Sega Master System game: Aerial Assault and retitled AREA 88 would be bad ass, and wouldn't be a stretch seeing as how A.A. was just a ripoff of AREA 88 anyhow.  Hell that might even be more feasible then seeing the actual Capcom game make it's way onto the 8-BIT Famicom!

Better not get too excited though, probably couldn't find anyone to do what I'm thinking anyhow.  I just get a bit sad sometimes when I see a buttoad of "unofficial" games on the Famicom, but a good deal of them (IMO) aren't what I would have picked at all.  On that note I've often wondered why more companies that did make official games for NCL back in the day, always seemed to neglect some of their more kick ass arcade games in porting them to the Famicom/NES (or any system for that matter).  A list of some of my dream games, that I personally would pay to have put on the FC/NES in cart form.

L.S.A. SQUAD
~1986: Taito Corp:  ***I mean really!  This was a much better
game than Capcom's 1985 released "Wolf of the Battlefield" (Commando)
and might have given Capcom a run for their money back when the LSA SQUAD
was still new.  Instead we got a crappy port of "Operation Wolf"


AREA 88
~1989: CAPCOM: ***already mentioned above and the impetus of this thread.

Carrier Air Wing
~1990: CAPCOM: ***This spiritual sequel to AREA 88 didn't even get a Super Fami
port for God's sake!  I'd like to see this somehow ported to the 8-BIT FC personally
but like with the (2) above, it's probably just a wet dream. 


Bloody Wolf
~1988: Nihon Bussan/AV Japan: ***Yeah, I know... it got ported to the much more
colorful PC Engine/Turbo Grafx 16 system for HuCard, but I always felt there wasn't
enough RGS games on the FC system personally.

AND THAT'S JUST A FEW OF WHAT I HAVE IN MIND REALLY, as I could be here all night listing every possible oddity and/or forgotten arcade game or competitor's console exclusive (at the time) that I would as of 2009, seriously pay Neo-Geo cartridge prices for to see done (with some effort though) on and for the FC/NES.  What you all think?

[nintendodork]

133MHz has the knowledge to do it, I bet.  But I don't think he would have a whole lot of time, plus, he's on vacation right now.

[Rogles]

To do it, you'd need a THOROUGH knowledge of Assembly language. Which is just hexadecimal code. Which is like one of the lowest-level programming languages.

[UglyJoe]

It's not quite hexadecimal code.  There are mnemonics for assembly instructions and code constructs such as labels that aid the process.  You *can* do it in pure hexadecimal, but there's no good reason to do so.

Building a game from scratch takes a lot of time.  For something decent, it would probably take a couple of months (and that's assuming the coder didn't have a day job).

Porting an SMS game really doesn't help the process.  The graphics are there, which is a help, but, beyond that, you're pretty much starting from scratch.  A hack of an existing FC/NES game is more feasible.

[Blue Protoman]

But that wouldn't be porting the game.  It'd be useless unless you changed the gameplay mechanics or the levels, but even then it wouldn't be the original game.

The easiest way to code for the NES would be if Nintendo released their developer's kits, but that's probably not going to happen.

[Agent X]

133MHz has the knowledge to do it, I bet.  But I don't think he would have a whole lot of time, plus, he's on vacation right now.

Hmm...

Might have to at least make him an offer and see what he says then.  Won't hold my breath but if there's one thing in life I've learned is that it never hurts to ask.  Good to know someone here might have the skills needed to pull it off, shoot if only for one game done, I'd pay top dollar for a decent-to-kick ass 8-BIT FC port/hack of AREA 88.  Probably my all time fave shooter, but then I happen to dig the  more "military" type shooters over all the space stuff, always have.  Sonic Wings/Aero Fighters 1 & 2 would also be cool to see on the good ole' Famicom too.

Building a game from scratch takes a lot of time.  For something decent, it would probably take a couple of months (and that's assuming the coder didn't have a day job).

Porting an SMS game really doesn't help the process.  The graphics are there, which is a help, but, beyond that, you're pretty much starting from scratch.  A hack of an existing FC/NES game is more feasible.

#1) Well I figured as much (time management wise), but it be something I'd seriously want to look into as a "possibility" none the less, no matter who it would be undertaking such a project.  I remember wanting to do this with Neo-Geo MVS games at some point back in '02, but I figure doing 8-BIT games versus the much more (and bigger) complicated 16/24-BIT games might be easier?  I dunno tech stuff though so I could be wrong.

#2) A hack on an existing game could work indeed.  Possibly something like using the engine of Gradius 2 in terms of horizontal game play for an AREA 88 "port" then coding in the respective Earth based levels and backgrounds with appropriate jet fighters etc.  I simply thought that an existing 8-BIT game if even for a competitor console from back in the day might have proven to make such an undertaking a bit easier.  Guess not though.

The easiest way to code for the NES would be if Nintendo released their developer's kits, but that's probably not going to happen.

Yeah I don't think I'll hold my breath for such a thing from NCL. 

[L___E___T]

I have a number of personal projects that are ongoing and similar.   When I saw the Mr. Splash video I got so excited, but the reality of coding in assembly from scratch is no small feat, even coding with the limits on Fami Basic is a big job.   Let's assume you pulled that off, you still gotta make the carts / boards to do it properly.

So I just decided in the end to use a program like game maker and adhere to all the famicom rules.  It's not the same I know, but it means you can release it online etc, plus it has a recipe that someone with the time and knowledge could always port to famicom code.

After all that, I think the best bet is to find a suitable base for a hack and redraw all the graphics and enemy patterns etc.  Though that again is no small job for anyone who has a full time job!

[FAMICOMfag]

Yeah, but the point of playing it on a real famicom is not there...

[L___E___T]

yup, but then look at how much fun game center CX is.  I think original hardware is overrated when other emulators can do the sound and colours better but I know most don't agree.

Trouble is, it's just so, so, so much work and money to do this on a real famicom, so you gotta compare the worth of that versus a pretend program.    You could mock something up yourself for free, or pay someone thousands to make you a new one, then pay a few more thousand to have the boards and cart shells made.  So is it worth all that cash?  Not in my opinion really.

[Blue Protoman]

Yeah, I'd rather go the MM9 way and make a game then fake the NES rules, instead of code the entire thing from scratch.

[L___E___T]

The only other middle ground I would suggest is:

Find a suitable game to hack - hack yourself or pay someone a few hundred to hack, then take that rom info and give it to NES repro guy, have him load it onto an EPROM and ship it to you and swap that on an original cart of the hacked game, re-case, make a new label and/or box and you're set.

I think that could work supposing there is a suitable hack and you're able to actually get that hack made or able to do it yourself.  They're both pretty big ifs when you think about it.

[Agent X]

Yeah, but the point of playing it on a real famicom is not there...

Yep. my thoughts exactly.  Though I guess any distrib possibility is better than nothing as well.  I'd definitely want an FC cart though.  A good deal of people go through "original" releases for emulators that I've seen, but I figure if mainland China *Pirates* and other motivated individuals can come up with a lot of dreck, surely there must be someone out there who can make a decent game that isn't buggy to hell and put it out on the phyiscal/tangible system in cart form.  ~Ahhh... the musings and dreams of an FC Fanboi. 

The only other middle ground I would suggest is:

Find a suitable game to hack - hack yourself or pay someone a few hundred to hack, then take that rom info and give it to NES repro guy, have him load it onto an EPROM and ship it to you and swap that on an original cart of the hacked game, re-case, make a new label and/or box and you're set.

I think that could work supposing there is a suitable hack and you're able to actually get that hack made or able to do it yourself.  They're both pretty big ifs when you think about it.

You know with a few hundred bucks saved up ($300 to $700) for the initial paying of someone to do the work needed to make a decent-to-kick ass AREA 88 game, be it a brand new game using similar or somehow Mugen-ed ripped sprites inserted into a game... an 8-BIT port of the Arcade game... a port of the Super Fami version, or even somehow just redoing that SMS "Aerial Assault" game with a retitled title screen and select screen for fighter jets (thinking Arcade version here)... WELL, this just  might be a viable option.  Convoluted and as around the big block as it might be, it could/might work indeed.  This would definitely be something I'd have to save up some snaps for, and no doubt it be some kind of future dev project.  No way I could do it myself, so it have to be farmed out to a talented individual or small group who had enough free time to even do it.  Not that I'd be unrealistic about a "finish date" or anything, as it not like it needs to make some launch date as official carts did BITD. 

In fact this idea of yours sounds the most feasible really, only I'd want that Repro to be on an actual Famicom cartridge/cassette and not the bigger toaster NES cart.  I know people used to use one of the Fatal Fury games (FF3 if I remember correctly) as a sacrificial/sac cartridge to put other games onto it for special projects within the Neo:Geo hobby and even bootleg scene, so I figure something like that could be done here as well.  Thanks for the input, to all of you!

[FAMICOMfag]

Yeah, I'd rather go the MM9 way and make a game then fake the NES rules, instead of code the entire thing from scratch.

True, MM9 wouldn't have been as fun on a real famicom/nes. Have you noticed how the game itself is slightly faster and how the flow of the game is perfect ? On a NES it would have had many lag  and clipping issues.

[L___E___T]

You can turn the sprite limit on MM9 to on but yeah it has no slowdown and runs at a perfect 60hz throughout.

Agent X - the repro thing I mentioned would work on a real fami cart, but you'd have to supply the guy with a donor board of the original game and the hack could be programmed onto a new EPROM then swapped onto th cart, so you could then recase it and it'd be playable, in theory on a famicom.

I think realistically, you'd have to pay someone at least 300 bucks to make an Area 88 hack,  No-one could make a full game for under a thousand from scratch, it's just a no-go.  China and pirates are different because nasty people are often involved in these things so people end up doing that work for pittance or are forced to, even.

The master system idea isn't really viable, because although you could replace the graphics, you can't just convert master system code into famicom code, it would be easier to just start fresh in fami code like Joe said.

[Agent X]

Agent X - the repro thing I mentioned would work on a real fami cart, but you'd have to supply the guy with a donor board of the original game and the hack could be programmed onto a new EPROM then swapped onto th cart, so you could then recase it and it'd be playable, in theory on a famicom.

I think realistically, you'd have to pay someone at least 300 bucks to make an Area 88 hack,  No-one could make a full game for under a thousand from scratch, it's just a no-go.  China and pirates are different because nasty people are often involved in these things so people end up doing that work for pittance or are forced to, even.

The master system idea isn't really viable, because although you could replace the graphics, you can't just convert master system code into famicom code, it would be easier to just start fresh in fami code like Joe said.

#1) I'm actually leaning towards this idea of yours.  Sounds pretty "sound" to me.

#2) Shoot if the hack were "decent" (meaning you could actually play the game and the sound wasn't too blipitty/blopitty) I'd gladly thrown down $300USD, maybe even a little more for it to be done.  Sure, I'm only a Hundredaire, and don't have money to burn really, but for things such as this... I tend to put money away and would seriously (once accumulated) set into motion such a project.  Now if I could get into contact with someone (or a small group) who before such a project was initiated and who was trustworthy stated:  "Odd request, but yeah... we can do an original game... for the money" then knowing my neurotic self, I'd save up about fifteen hundred and get back to them when I had the means, then pay half up front and the rest on completion.  But what can I say.  I'm a weirdo like this.  I'm like 95% Retro Gaming and only 5% current (if you'd consider PS2 still current) and thus the new flashier stuff doesn't interest me much.  I'm forever liking new games, new/previously unreleased games and hacks (when decent) for mainly the 8-BIT Famicom and 16-BIT Mega Drive.  If I had any kind of programming skills I'd no doubt do this stuff myself then release the ROMs to the public at large after doing a limited run of tangible media... but alas... no skillz is me in the tech/programming department outside of HTML.

#3) Well that's too bad.  I didn't realize that a lot of these hack/bootlegs of games like Street Fighter 2, Samurai Spirits 2, and Super Contra Spirits weren't just somehow using original source codes for other platforms and then somehow dumbing them down to an 8-BIT palette and remapping the controls and stuff to work with a 2 button configuration.  I mean, I realize that no two lines of code are going to be the same, and that games are programmed for their respective OS, but I just thought (remember I don't do this stuff) it might be possible to just rip sprites and background and some how do a cut & paste type job (I'm thinking MUGEN-esque) and then utilize an existing engine for a FC/NES game that would be pretty close to what was needed.  Guess I have to give the bootleggers of the world some credit then afterall. 


Well thanks for the responses on this. 
Even creative articulation can get a ball
game going sometimes.